Fig Flavor Groups

**Kelby** · 04-16-2015, 10:20 AM

Good post! I've used these groups a lot in my selection of varieties. To self promote the hardy fig list in my signature has Pete's lists above plus some extra info anyone is interested.

**jkuo** · 04-16-2015, 10:24 AM

What's the definition of cold hardy in this list? There are a few cultivars there that I thought were considered relatively cold hardy, like Ronde de Bordeaux.

**mountainfigs** · 04-16-2015, 11:28 AM

Pete, I haven't seen a better breakdown/organization of fig flavor groups, though my sense of things is marginally different. I'll list here the notations I sometimes use to label these approximate groups, not to supplant your notation but to possibly spur ideas for further refining or elaborating the groupings.

Sugar = sugar, liquid sugar, sugary, sharp sugar
Honey = complex honey, honey, creamy, sweet cream, complex cream, honey cream, intense cream
Adriatic Berry = intense berry, intense strawberry, (intense) spicy berry
Bordeaux Berry = musky berry, dense berry, strawberry, sharp berry
Dark Berry = berry punch, grape-strawberry punch, punch
Exotic Berry = tropical, citrus, mango, apple, mixed

I don't know that these descriptors would accord with your tastes or the tastes of others. This is how they've seemed to me.

The descriptors Adriatic, Bordeaux, Dark, and Exotic don't convey ready meaning on their surface it seems to me. In my own mind, I sort those categories as Intense Berry, Musky Berry, Berry Punch, and Tropical. That said, "tropical" at least is also vague.

Sugar and Honey are a little too close in my mind, though surely not in the minds of others. But I wonder if some of the cultivars in the Honey category might at some point wind up in a combined Sugary/Honey category and the Honey category be replaced by an Intense or Complex Cream category. Or an Intense/Complex Cream category might be added to the Sugar and Honey categories. My Janice Kadota is not a sugar or honey or exotic/tropical but more of an intense complex cream with (as of last year) a kind of brandy ice cream flavor.

Just food for thought, maybe for future refining of the groupings. For now it seems that your request for feedback on cultivar flavors could be very useful. New flavor groupings or labelings might or might not arise from those incoming views.

In addition to a complex cream category, I might also add a light berry or light strawberry category into which I would currently put Binello and Conadria.

I would add Malta Black to Bordeaux Berry, as a kind of sharp berry, sharp strawberry.

I would add Emerald Strawberry (143-36) to Adriatic Berry, as an intense spicy berry/strawberry, also Paradiso GM #9, another intense example.

Hunt under Honey, as a complex honey but it could go under sugar or even under a new borderline strawberry category.

For me, LSU Purple and Lemon/Blanche have fit in the exotic/tropical category - citrus and mango coming through.

My current flavor perception goes something like this below (with one example of each, though clear classes of figs seem to fall distinctly into these categories):

Sugar/Honey Gel - Improved Celeste
Complex Cream Gel - Janice Kadota
Intense Strawberry Jam - Emerald Strawberry
Musky Strawberry Jam - Violette de Bordeaux
Strawberry Punch Jam - Marseilles Black
Light Strawberry Gel - Binello
Tropical Gel - Lemon/Blanche

Maybe this year I will be able to make better distinctions between Sugar and Honey. Maybe I'll be able to expand (or collapse) the notion of a Complex Cream category. Maybe I'll get a better broader feel for the Exotic or Tropical category. Maybe I'll want to reclassify Malta Black, and so on.

For now at least, the figs as I've grown them around here seem to break down into those four distinct strawberry gel categories: Intense, Musky, Punch, and Light. (I sometimes think of "Light" as "Fresh". And if Malta Black is to be shoehorned into the Bordeaux/Musky category, it's not so much Musky as Sharp.) So, the four basic categories of Strawberry, plus the sugar/honey, the cream, and the tropical. To this point.

By "strawberry" or "berry" or "grape" in all the above, I mean strawberry or berry or grape jam, jelly, or gel, not the berries themselves. The jam, jelly, or gel connote the apparent higher sugar level and the different texture found in the figs than in the berries.

**greenfig** · 04-16-2015, 03:04 PM

I assume all those flavors refer to the uncaprified figs , right?
It seems we would need one list for California and another for the rest of the US. I believe there will be some differences.

**Harborseal** · 04-16-2015, 04:10 PM

What about the peach and melon tasting figs?

**F. Bennett** · 04-16-2015, 04:37 PM

Great thread Pete! Very helpful.

**armando93223** · 04-16-2015, 06:15 PM

Great Topic: From visiting our local nurseries last year. I tasted the Kadota and Peter's Honey which were very similar. I enjoyed Janice Kadota it was much larger than Kadota very similar taste I ate a Conadria in the neighborhood and it tasted very similar to Kadota. I think the sugar content can get very high on these varieties and create a sameness in taste. Remember we get some intense heat here in Central California.

**smithmal** · 03-22-2016, 02:39 PM

Need help categorizing the flavor for the following varieties:

Dark Brooklyn
Flanders
Marylane Seedless
Panachee
Pastiliere
Morena

Thanks in advance.

**don_sanders** · 03-22-2016, 09:54 PM

Haven't tasted Flanders but it has been described as honey, maple, and / or slight strawberry.

**Zuny** · 05-11-2016, 11:03 AM

This is a great post specially for people starting out like myself. Very informative as far as the different kinds of fig flavors and cultivar groups. This will help me create a great plat form my fig collection.

**hstark** · 05-11-2016, 01:17 PM

This is such a fantastic post and so helpful! Well, maybe not, makes me want more figs to try

. Thanks for doing this!!!

**AscPete** · 05-11-2016, 02:29 PM

Here's another topic with the same theme...

http://www.ourfigs.com/forum/figs-ho...r-should-taste

Which include the "Gateway" cultivars that are more readily available.

**mountainfigs** · 05-11-2016, 05:14 PM

After last year's growing season I began sorting figs into groups combining their skin color and flavor profile.
The resultant six groupings below are not perfect but fit surprisingly well.
The sugar flavor figs tend to be dark skinned, brown or blue, with amber or brownish pulp.
The honey flavored figs tend to be light skinned, yellow or green, with gold, light amber, or clear pulp.
Then there are the intense versus less intense light and dark skinned figs, berry flavored with reddish pulp.
By intense I mean roughly very sweet and complex flavor versus a somewhat less sweet and less complex flavor, again roughly.
Below, "light" and "dark" refer to skin color not flavor.

FIG FLAVOR GROUPS AND CULTIVARS

DARK SUGAR
LSU Improved Celeste, LSU Purple, Brunswick, LSU O'Rourke, Hunt, Celeste, Brown Turkey

LIGHT HONEY
Marseilles (Lattarula, Italian Honey), LSU Champagne, Alma, Janice Kadota, Excel, Mary Lane, LSU Gold, Lemon (Blanche)

DARK BERRY
Mongibello (Mt Etna, aka Hardy Chicago, etc...), Ronde de Bordeaux, LSU (Scott's) Black, Palermo Red (aka Aldo's, Sal's C, etc...)

LIGHT BERRY
Brooklyn White, Conadria, Latarolla (Lyndhurst White)

INTENSE DARK BERRY
Violette de Bordeaux (Negronne, etc...), Black Madeira (Figo Preto), Bourjasotte Noir (Violette de Sollies, etc...), Col de Dame Noir

INTENSE LIGHT BERRY
White Triana, Paradiso (Battaglia Green), Adriatic, Calverte, Emerald Strawberry, Panachée, JH Adriatic

There are some problems with these groupings above but for me they clarify a lot. Some problems, for example: Hunt is a brown fig (sometimes green/brown) that is very sweet like a sugar fig, and creamy like a honey fig, and tinged with a bit of berry flavor like a berry fig. It has amber pulp like a sugar fig but tinged sometimes with red like a berry fig. How to classify? Sugar because so sheer sweet? Honey because especially creamy? Berry because, well, sometimes berryish? It looks most like a sugar fig, has a high brix count so should probably be classified as that. Take LSU Purple. To me, when fully ripe it has a strong maple sugar flavor, rather than sheer or plain sugar. I think of it as a sugar fig with a particular flavor. Take Brooklyn White (aka Naples White), very sweet like a sugar fig but with a mixed honey and berry flavor. It's light skinned so could be considered a honey fig, and it's sweeter than the typical berry fig so could be considered an intense berry fig except that the flavor is not as complex as the typical intense berry fig. The pulp I consider a glazed berry, a mix of clear gel and red gel. Some people reasonably consider it a honey fig, while I classify it as a light berry fig. And so on.

**greenfig** · 05-11-2016, 05:47 PM

Tony,

Thanks for the list.
I would like to add that your classification refers to the non-pollinated figs only assuming ideal growing conditions.
The pollinated version would be a bit different. In general, the taste tends to be more "intense".

**Zuny** · 05-11-2016, 09:37 PM

Jamie,
Thank you. Even with all this researching I can still see myself becoming fig crazy. I love gardening and growing fruit trees. My dream would be to have my own orchard someday but that is a bit out of my reach. I love the idea of growing my own food in my back yard and being only a few steps from great fruit.

This is a great group with a lot of information and people who are glad to help. I am glad I found it.

**hstark** · 05-11-2016, 10:01 PM

I second the above!! What a wealth of information!! Having not been here very long, I don't know how any of you resist the 'gotta have em all' urge. ESPECIALLY with the descriptions... omg. LOL. I think I just wiped drool off my chin...

**ross** · 05-12-2016, 12:55 PM

I really don't understand the differences between Bordeaux Berry and Dark Berry. Could someone explain? The rest.. I've got my head around very well.

**mountainfigs** · 05-12-2016, 05:20 PM

Thanks for the thoughts on the 6 flavor/color groupings.

I agree that Bordeaux, Adriatic, Exotic ... are unnecessarily opaque descriptors, useful to those in the know but not so much on their surface.

Agreed that fig flavors can basically be broken down further from 5 or 6 (or more) to 3 categories (or possibly even 2): sugar, honey, berry types, in other words, various sugary gels, various honey or cream gels, and various berryish gels. (That said, most of the honey figs I've tasted seem to me more like agave syrup or agave gel than honey gel. Honey conveys the gist though. And we have the Italian Honey fig (White Marseilles, Lattarula) not the Italian Agave fig.) Talking unpollinated figs here.

I included skin color with the flavor groupings for various reasons:

1) I noticed that all the sugar types I knew were dark skinned and had pulp with the colors mentioned, and that all the honey types were light skinned with the aforementioned pulp colors. Simply made sense. I wonder if it will hold.

2) Most people acquire trees or consume figs based on the fruits' appearance, often color, as well as taste; also, the former may affect or be related to the latter. So it seems important. Many people, including myself, want to enjoy growing and eating both light and dark skinned figs even if the flavor may be similar.

3) There is such a great number and diversity of cultivars of figs that getting a good handle, a concise yet detailed grip on key features across the broad spectrum, seems well warranted. You've got your dark sugars, your light honeys, your simple fruity darks and lights, and your intense, especially sweet or complex, berry lights and darks.

A classification of six particular yet encompassing categories doesn't seem too much to ask for basic flavor/color views of a fruit with more than a myriad named variants. 3 categories works too though, as noted. Growers of figs would probably be interested in at least 6 categories, while consumers of figs might usually be interested in knowing 2-4 categories: Is it a light fig or a dark fig? Is it fruity or sugary?

As for the Bordeaux flavor, both RDB and VDB seem to me to have a little more resin flavor than typical, a molasses flavor as I think of it, so I can see why the Bordeauxs are sometimes classified unto themselves, or with a few other similar types. Scientists say that resin, sort of an anti-flavor as I think of it, musky or like molasses, gives figs their characteristic figgy flavor. Makes sense, though curious that certain figs are more figgy, resinous, than others and that to my taste buds at least, a relatively few number of cultivars seem to have much resinous taste, aftertaste, or characteristic at all. Sometimes the sugars may overpower the resin, I imagine, though other times the flavors seem simply light as with the honey figs or fresh and fruity as with the berry figs.

Regarding "intense" as flavor descriptor, I assume that essentially all fig cultivars can taste "intense" when allowed to reach the "dead ripe" stage under ideal conditions. Under such conditions, a fruity punchy cultivar like Mongibello with normally a relatively low brix count can achieve both a sugar spike and a flavor explosion, making it taste intense: especially sweet, complex, powerful.

However, when various cultivars are all compared at, say, a mid-ripe stage, certain cultivars will be sweeter than other cultivars, and/or more complex and, say, potent of flavor. Some of this has been studied and charted scientifically, brix counts for example. So when comparing figs of different cultivars at the same stage of ripeness, all other things equal, then inherent differences of sweetness and flavor complexity, etc, do emerge. (Whether or not I've charted that accurately by cultivar, is another question.)

**Altadena Mara** · 05-13-2016, 12:20 PM

Thanks for the description of the resin taste. I was noticing a wine-like under taste to the Bordeaux figs and since a good wine is fermented or aged in resinous wooden casks that is the taste that makes them different.

**susieqz** · 02-17-2017, 11:15 PM

you know, i used pete's taste classifications, trying to get one of each flavor inground.
results show trees don't follow rules.
my first fig, a tissue culture hardy chicago from hirts is unquestionably a hardy chicago.
grown in soil that is largely limestone, with ph adjusted in the semi desert, there was no berry taste whatsoever.
it is 100 % honey.
i love the taste, but i'm sad that i now have no berry flavor fig.
taste in one location may not be the same in another.

**AscPete** · 02-18-2017, 01:20 PM

Hello susieqz ,

Glad to see you posting...

It may be that the tree needs to mature, especially if its the first time ripening figs, but Hardy Chicago is usually (always) a berry flavored cultivar.

**susieqz** · 02-19-2017, 12:25 AM

guys, i wasn't complaining about my honey flavor hardy chicago. i enjoy the strong honey flavor, which is no cloying at all.
i have scanned dozens of pics of both leaves n fruit n it's identical to those hardy chicagos tat have been posted.
i wonder if growing in soil that is largely limestone may change taste?
or, 4100' elevation?
i do need to find a berry flavor that will grow under poor conditions.
even wrapped, some trees won't take winter temps near zero, tho they like 100 degree days..

**Rigo007** · 12-06-2018, 01:16 PM

Very helpful post indeed. Now I have a better idea as to which group variety I'd like to stick with.

**Rigo007** · 12-08-2018, 07:29 AM

Can someone do an update of the list adding more variations to the OPs list? It's a really helpful topic but with more variations added, it simplifies it for us newbies.

Fig Flavor Groups

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