I Love Coco Coir!

[Dave]

If you asked 20 people how to root fig cuttings you'll get 20 different methods and I believe what works well for one person may not work so well for the next I started using coco coir and I will never change my method

I started these cuttings roughly 3 weeks ago and here's what they look like today all I do is put a little coir in the bottom of the cup dip the end of the cutting in Clonex put the cutting in the cup and fill it up with coir then I water it with the sprinkler in the kitchen sink let it drain off a good bit put it in the plastic tote leave the top of the tote cracked sometiimes changing the paper towels in the bottom of the tote if they get saturated I open the top everyday still leaving it cracked never fully closing it and this is the result after 3 weeks and they still don't need water this is my third year using this method

[Jamie0507]

For some reason I can't see any pics Dave.. Is it just me? I'm loving the coco coir myself but if I don't get every drop of excess water out, its mold city for my cuttings! Although I left a bag of bag of coir that I washed & wrung out well to dry on its own for a few weeks and now it's perfect for rooting! I'm loving the results, only problem is I have to make sure I prepare the coir well in advance so it can dry out enough.. Sounds like you are not having this issue at all though! Hmm I wonder what the heck I'm doing wrong?

[joann1536]

I can't see them, either. But I have to agree with you on the coco coir. So far, no gnats. They killed most of my rooted cuttings last year.

[Dave]

Can you see the pictures now?

[Jamie0507]

Yes & they look AHHH-mazing! Look at those roots for only 3 weeks.. Awesome work Dave, I would not change a thing if I were you.. This method obviously works very well!

[Dave]

Jamie Last year when I did the cuttings I thought they were too wet but they all rooted no rot no mildew this year I was going to change the method and use moist coir and no watering when I potted them up ,,, but I didn't potted the cuttings watered them with the sprayer and everything worked out well again just like I said above what works for one person may not work for the next ??? One suggestion I will give is leave the box open I never have trouble weaning the cuttings off the humidity Good Luck with your cuttings

[Jamie0507]

I'm wondering Dave if the difference could be related to whether you are using the ready to go coco coir out of a bag or if you are using the compressed brick.. Which one are you using out of curiosity? I'm thinking that may be the difference only because I have to add a great deal of water to it right off the bat just to decompress it. Then I have to make sure to wash out all the salts, which seems to take a ton of water to do.. It's completely soup before I'm done and then I'm giving myself arthritis from trying to wring it all out lol, and no matter what I never get it close to dry.. However once it does dry out, man the stuff is awesome! I put a few paper towels in the bag (or container) and it's amazing from there.. I'll have to try sticking a little popsicle stick between the lid and container to prop it open just a bit.. Maybe I won't even need the paper towels that way

[jkuo]

Jamie, what brand coir are you getting? I bought FibreDust and Hydrofarm bricks, and they've worked just fine for me without rinsing. They were advertised as being low EC and/or suitable as a planting mix. Rinsing out the salts shouldn't be necessary unless you picked a brand where they don't properly rinse the coir.

[Jamie0507]

Hi Johnny This last batch that I had the problems with is General Hydroponics brand & called CocoTek. It was suppose to be prewashed for sand & salts before compression, but l did see in fine print (after the purchase naturally lol) that each bag differs in salt content and should be washed well by the grower before use.. Dohhhh! Total face palm on that one..

[DBJohnson]

So, I'm guessing I need to remove the lids on these ASAP.... I did not add any moisture to this stuff. It's straight from the bag.

[Jamie0507]

The water holding capacity of coir is insane! I have had the ample amounts of condensation on lids as well..

[Dave]

Bryant when my box gets like that I pull all the cuttings out and wipe it down dry thats way too wet for me

[DBJohnson]

Not getting as much condensation now...but the lids are still off. Basement has turned a good deal cooler with the colder weather...not sure what it's at(getting a thermometer for down here later today). Bins are on a heat mat set to 70F.

[WillsC]

Wet coir with dead air is a recipe for disaster.......this I learned first hand

[Jamie0507]

I saw your nifty method for squeezing out the excess water in your coir Wills! Now If I only had some heavy machinery laying around I'd be all good! Lol! Best thing I have found so far laying around in my house is a potato ricer! Lol

[DBJohnson]

I've been airing them out daily since I set them up this weekend. I will put enough to refill the bins out to dry out some before I go to bed. Tomorrow, I'll check and replace what's in there now if the new coir is dry enough.

[fitzski]

With respect to wringing out the coir in small batches (not like how WillsC or Hershell do it), what I use is a tight mesh tray that you get from the garden center. Put a few inches of coco coir in it, put a 6' x 12' cement paver block on top, put it on the ground with a few garden stakes underneath and step on it.

I do this a few times, moving the coco coir on the outside to the middle and it seems to get most of the moisture out.

I then let it air dry for a day or so while mixing it up a few times.

I'm only using it for pre-rooting right now but it seems to be ok. No rot so far (knock on wood).

[Jamie0507]

That's a great idea Kevin! You can get a lot more done in one shot than my potato ricer method.. That's for sure! Lol

[fitzski]

Jamie,

A little more efficient than the potato ricer but the ricer is probably a better work out

[Kelby]

Good results! I'm currently trying coir for the first time. No roots yet but the cuttings look good.

[DBJohnson]

So...a question. In what method/application are you using the coir? Direct pot, rooting box, cups, bags?

I'm currently using it in my rooting boxes.

[DBJohnson]

When I reloaded the page again, the pics finally showed up. So Dave is using it in cups.

[WillsC]

The picture issue was my fault

[DBJohnson]

I figured Hershell did something.

[Taverna78]

Check list please....


Is cocos premium good to use?
Use heat mat?
Parafilm?
No perlite?
Can go in Rubbermaid top off in greenhouse 75F+ with 70% humid ?
Cup dry then water until come out bottom holes?
No more water after tis?
Keep under lights?

[Dave]

Is cocos premium good to use? .................................................. ................yes
Use heat mat? .................................................. ........................................... no
Parafilm? .................................................. .................................................. ..no
No perlite?.......................................... .................................................. .........no
Can go in Rubbermaid top off in greenhouse 75F+ with 70% humid ?........yes
Cup dry then water until come out bottom holes? .......................................yes
No more water after tis?.............................................. .................................yes
Keep under lights?........................................... ............................................when you see leaves

[Taverna78]

Grazie

[Otis]

Tried to p.m. you but your box is full. Tony

[Harborseal]

So, Dave, you're cuckoo for coco coir? (I don't know how old you need to be to get that)

I'm glad this is working well for you, Dave. It will be crucial to use the same brand or a brand with similar coir characteristics to achieve this result. Some brands have more salt, some brands have more fiber, some have all fluff and some brands have larger chips, What brand are you using, Dave?

Also, that 'drawing moisture out of the air' thing may not happen outside of humid areas. It almost certainly won't happen in a home heated 40+ degrees over the outside temperature. Worse yet, drawing a lot of water out of the air may be a sign of salt in your coir. Of course in the SE US it doesn't take much for condensation to happen.

[Hobo62288]

Well I'm 27 and I got it. Def remember those commercials. Never did like chocolate cereal though.

[Dave]

Bob This is what I used just because I have a Roots CT store in my town "Hydroponics store"I think it was around $15.00 for the block after I soaked it it filled 2 sheetrock buckets

Bob do you really think it makes a difference which brand coir you use???

[Harborseal]

Definitely. Some are 70% long fibers. Maybe you could show us a photo of the hydrated stuff.

[Harborseal]

Just so happens my favorite hydroponics store can get it. Thanks.

[Dave]

I definitely would not want the long fiber nice thing about this stuff here when you take the cutting out of the cup all the coir falls away from the roots "remember the tangled up mess with the sphagnum moss"

[GregMartin]

Compared to peat moss, does coir wet out much more easily?

Bob, I know that being 45 is old enough first hand.

[Jamie0507]

I believe it does Greg but I'm pretty new to this and only used SM a couple times so far..

[GregMartin]

Thanks Jamie, I'll have to give it a shot. All that coir in Wills car should have convinced me

[strudeldog]

I am just trying Coir for the 1st time. I didn't realize folks used it as the potting media straight and left them in it to grow out. I was planning on just using as I do sphagnum Moss and then move to a potting mix. Isn't that how most use it? I had a hard time using just part of the block ending up using a bow saw was about ready to crank the chain saw. I saw the warnings on salt so I way over-hydrated then probably lost a % straining into a towel and wringing it out. I had no idea it was that fine. Now I am looking to leave open put a fan on a fluff around some as I still feel way too wet even after putting in a towel wringing until my knuckles are blue. Maybe in few days will get where I want, I might chicken out an pull out the sphagnum Moss Is this a good brand of coir in the pic?

[smatthew]

General Hydroponics is usually fine.

[strudeldog]

Thanks Scott. I am drying it out surprised how fine of particles it is I sure can't just grab and squeeze like like Sphagnum Moss. I really hydrated to try and rinse the salts out. Felt like I was squeezing runny oatmeal. I have a fan on it now probably a few days and fluffing until I can use. I doubt I will hydrate this much again.

[Jamie0507]

Phil that's the brand I just used.. However I think there may be two different styles that GH makes.. One being better for our purposes and one I believe that fibers are longer.. From the way you describe it I believe you have the right brand. I too experienced the blue knuckles lol and oatmeal type texture you did though and the stuff seems to stay super wet for a long time. Maybe try placing a few paper towels in it and see how fast they soak up water? I've done that and it helps me to decipher if it is way too wet yet or if it's just right

[Brian M]

I have been using the brick coir 3 pack from pets co. Going on two years now. Never worried about salts and never had an issue.I like direct potting like Dave then drop into a gallon pot with potting mix. I must add that I try to bury at least half of the cutting and possibly 3/4 into coir. No heat may just room temperature.

[Dave]

thats the way I do it it works every time

[Gina]

I've been trying coir for the first time this year and, yes, it does matter which brand you use. The first one I tried (got good reviews on Amazon) was a stringy mess - it had way too much fibrous materials (1/3 to 1/2) and I had to screen it. It also must have had salt in it because seeds I tried to germinate in it didn't do very well. I watched a Youtube video about processing coir, and I think for some companies there is very little quality control.

Second brand was much better. Virtually no fibers and was soft and usable after wetting. Unfortunately I don't remember the brands.

I also got some from HomeDepot that said it was rinsed, but I haven't tried it yet.

[Dave]

if your in doubt this would be a good way to rinse your coir out just do this procedure and few times

[Jamie0507]

That's a pretty nifty idea Dave, thanks for posting

[Harborseal]

Coir and peat expand a lot more easily with warm water than with cold.

[Dave]

My son visited me last night who had just gotten into the fig hobby and wanted some coir for some cuttings he got I sent him out to the shed and told him where it was so he could fill up a container for himself well when I went out to get some to do some cuttings I have I had a surprise he wiped me out so I went down to the Hydroponics Store any more blocks of the coir he said he had it in the bag and he said it would be the same as the blocks 1 bag filled 2 sheetrock buckets filled to the top the bag was a little pricey $25.00 but it was an emergency

[DBJohnson]

OK, so this was my first experience with coir and I have to say...not impressed. The stuff was wet right out of the bag but after a week in the rooting boxes, my cuttings are looking dessicated and dry in amongst the damp coir. Just weird.

So I've pulled all cuttings from the coir and set them up in rooting boxes of sphagnum moss. It may take longer, butI have more experience and confidence in the SM.

[Sarahkt]

I've had terrible mold issues using coir. Lost a bunch of Lyndhurst White, Brooklyn White, and Improved Celeste cuttings leaving them in a bag of coir over the Thanksgiving holiday. I kept those cuttings in coir and some Galicia Negra cuttings have been the only casualties so far while rooting cuttings these season. Direct potting into ProMix HP with dilute MG and waxed tops and Parafilmed top ends has been just about foolproof. Going to stick with that and use the rest of the coir up in potting mixes.

Might have been a bad brand, bad batch, or just old coir, but troubleshooting would be a waste of time when the direct cupping works so well and eliminates one stage of rooting.

[don_sanders]

Do you happen to have a step by step guide of your successful method of rooting posted anywhere?

[Sarahkt]

Sure, I do actually, as of today. It's right here. I posted an update on my cuttings.

http://www.ourfigs.com/forum/figs-home/54542-how-are-your-cuttings-doing/page3

I haven't devised anything new with the method I use, just cobbled it together after reading others' experience and following in their footsteps. Gary (figgary) also had a lot of useful advice after I drowned the first cuttings with watery affection. You'll probably see that tons of others have done things this way too. And many love methods with coir, or both. Whatever works!

Other details: What I left out in that post is the initial prepping of cuttings. I prepped incoming cuttings by washing them in the sink with a little soapy water, rinsing it off, snipping the end a little for a fresh layer, rehydrating in Brita filter water for a while (a few min to overnight) if the cuttings look less than fresh, then added some bleach to soak in dilute bleach for 5 min. Dried with paper towels. Dipped top cut ends in melted candle wax from a burning candle or better yet, Paraffin wax melted a little by holding over a candle flame and rubbed over the cut areas repeatedly until covered (more flexible when the cutting grows).

I disinfected clippers before each cutting source to prevent unnecessary spreading of FMV, and trimmed a little off the bottom cut end to expose a fresh layer. I eyeball how much of the top end would be above the height of the cup, and wrap that part in Parafilm accordingly. I add an inch or so of loosely moistened ProMix HP (using dilute MG) to the bottom of the cup, then the cutting, then loosely fill the cup to the brim with more mix and lightly tamp it on the top, not too hard, to make sure it's secure and won't easily get jostled around in the cup. It's still pretty loose after the top inch.

When watering is necessary (usually after week or two on the heat mats without a humidity cup), I use Brita water in a Nalgene wash bottle around the outside perimeter in a controlled way to make sure I don't overdo it. When the cuttings are in the advanced super leafy stage, I occasionally water lightly with dilute MG or dilute organic seaweed and fish fertilizer to try to keep the leaves greener.

Cups have some holes soldered into them now. Before I got the soldering iron I used to whirl holes into cups with the tip of a paring knife. That wasn't dangerous at all.

[don_sanders]

Thanks!

[BrooklynMatty]

I'm getting nervous now, i got 2 bins full of cuttings (~30) right now with coir. I wrung it out as best as possible (knuckles went blue as mentioned above) but the humidity is at 90+% right now. I did parafilm the top portion of the cuttings like Mike had done since i will be moving these up to RH once they root. I guess ill check in a few days to see how things are going, but hoping they don't rot or mold.

I was planning on doing my coir baggie method in a few days as well with ~50 cuttings thanks to fruitnut.

[Sarahkt]

Hope my black thumb with coir didn't contribute to your nervousness. Don't worry, there are only two bad reports here, and it's worked great for the others! Will probably work great for you too.

[BrooklynMatty]

Hope so, thanks Sarah

[Brian M]

Air it out daily and fluff. Make sure they don't get compacted.

[WillsC]

IMHO The sphagnum moss is better but the coir is much easier and cheaper to use.

[lilfiggy]

Happy New Fig Growing Year everybody!!!! I am happy to report that I have much improved in my rooting ability over my nerdie newbie stinking first part of last year. I owe many thanks to everyone here and would like to report that I am off to a successful year this year rooting. First, I dropped the baggie method and went to the tupperware container method (you can buy just the right shoebox size at the Dollar Store (Yeah). I use bricks from the Pet Supermarket. I put them in a large flat storage tub and wet it with a weak solution of water and Bontone rooting powder. I don't drown it and keep mixing it until it is nice and fluffy. This takes a couple of days but I have a nice shelf that this sits on and use as needed. Then I wash my cuttings in a weak bleach solution and dry on paper towel. After drying, I take a craft paint brush and dip it in Clonex and paint the entire stem of the cutting. I lay them horizontally on the hydrated coir in my plastic container and cover with more coir. I snap on lids and put them in my portable green house. Since it was so humid here in South West Florida I check every so often to make sure it is not getting too wet. If it is I lay a paper towel over the top and put lid back over. The coir method is great for me. I did a control rooting with spag and baggie. nope. when I see leaves poking up I take boxes out and open lids. They are sitting on my lanai dining table and are about 3 inches tall now. This week I will put them in their cups and go from there. Thanks everyone for your support with cuttings and advice. My money is your money and I would rather spend here and support you and the forum. Such a great group of people. Look how we are growing and there has to be a reason for that.

[Dave]

Here's a little progress report roughly 4 weeks in and it's time to water What I do to water them is put them right in the sink and hit them with the sprayer let them sit and drain out and back in the box they go keeping the top of the box partial opened "all the time" I started with 30 cuttings and now I have 30 cuttings with roots didn't lose a single man some of them need to be potted as the cups are getting full of roots the nice thing about the coir is you can shake it right off of the roots when I used to use sphagnum moss which worked great but the only problem I was having is that you can't pull it out of the roots and when I would pot up a cutting it would be like a sponge on the roots in the soil and cause quite a bit of root rot like I said what works for one person doesn't necessarily work for the next "Happy Figging"

[cis4elk]

For me, this is the scary stage of growing out cuttings. I don't have much trouble at all getting them to this point, in past years my losses from "sudden cutting death" occur once rooted and growing in the cup. One day things are fine and then all of the sudden they're not.

After reading post #8 from Wills in the thread link below, I think maybe I was holding them in the cup too waiting for them to be nearly root bound. We will see I guess when I grow some cuttings again next year (none going this winter).

http://www.ourfigs.com/forum/figs-home/65434-making-mistakes-is-frustrating-but-also-a-very-good-way-to-learn?p=65506#post65506

Pecolator coffee is great, who needs all that plastic. I do wish I could find a good drip coffee maker though that wasn't filled with plastic parts.